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Northern Lights

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Ganja View Drop Down
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  Quote Ganja Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 March 2010 at 11:37
Well, I'd say that reading/reposting promotional material isn't the same thing as research.

If you read that massive chunk of text closely, you'll notice that it's not an attempt to define the history of NL, it's advertising designed to hype MNS and suggest that this rather new seed bank has a pedigree and history stretching back to the Eighties.

The first half has some facts (though muddled), while the second half is mostly about how fab MNS is.

Originally posted by an ad

Sam the Skunk Man claiming the Original Haze was a Mexican x Colombian variety, with Thai and south Indian lines added later in the Hazes development and the Mr. Nice Camp, who possess the earliest known examples of Haze in the world,

Yep. Sure. Older than the breeder who brought Haze to Europe and older than the breeders who have worked with those genetics since those times.

Originally posted by an ad

The Northern Lights #5 pedigree actually consists of Northern Lights #1 x Northern Lights #1

Never heard this claim before. Somewhere between 'highly dubious' and 'patently false'.

Originally posted by an ad

with seed stock from 1988 where the #5 cutting originated

NL#5 hybrids are offered in the 1987 TSB catalogue.

Originally posted by an ad

  Quite possibly the finest collection of Cannabis minds ever assembled, Mr. Nice seeds offers’ possibly the finest selection of cannabis genetics in the world today ... recently crowned lines of divine and royal descent

Hmmm, that sounds like neutral reporting of facts. Possibly.

Originally posted by an ad

  It is these very same Northern Lights varieties that were released all those years ago, which literally became famous world wide that Shantibaba at Mr. Nice seeds has exclusive access too, with the Northern Lights 5a still being in possession of the MNS team and future Northern Lights releases looming in the future. There for my friends, there is truly hope in the world after all

Anyone want to buy a bridge?

Originally posted by outlaw grower

the original nl that everybody wanted bred by Nevil at Seed bank

Actual research(instead of quoting advertising material) should have revealed the fact that the 'original NL bred by Nevil' covers quite a bit of ground. The follwing are taken from 3 TSB catalogues:

Cannabis Indica 'Northern Lights'
Northern Lights "9" x Skunk "1" F1 Hybrid
Northern Lights x Afghani "1" F1 Hybrid
Northern Lights #132A
Northern Lights #2
Northern Lights 1
Northern Lights 5 x Northern Lights 2
Northern Lights 5 x SK1 F-1 Hybrid
Northern Lights Mix

Haze x Northern Lights F-1 Hybrid
Northern Lights #1
Northern Lights #2
Northern Lights 5 x 2
Northern Lights 5 x Skunk #1 F-1 Hybrid

Hash Plant x Northern Lights #1 F-1 Hybrid
Hashplant/Northern Lights #1 x Swazi
Northern Lights #1 F-3
Northern Lights #2 F-3
Northern Lights #5 x Haze F-1 Hybrid
Northern Lights #5 x Skunk #1 F-1 Hybrid
Northern Lights 5 x 2 F-1 Hybrid

The original names have been used above, and in the first catalogues the nomenclature hadn't been standardised. So "Northern Lights 1" is almost certainly the same plant as "Northern Lights #1", but I've reproduced all the names, just to be on the safe side.

Frankly, this is why I don't get into these discussions very often - the people who think they have a point to argue are almost invariably quoting advertising material as if it was researched evidence. Put simply: it's not. There are a few important facts which most people who were there at the time agree upon. This leaves a lot of leeway for people to fill in the gaps in the way that suits them. Heck, look at the number of seed companies that claim to be established in the Eighties, when nearly every one was started in the mid-to-late Nineties.

Basically, you can try to draw your own conclusions from the various claims, or you can take the word of one source or another. Only one company has actually been trading seeds for 25 years, and that's Sensi.

Fair warning:
I'm going to remove the chunk of text at the top of this thread because the hyperbolic tone and the many inaccuracies nullify its informational value.
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Outlawgrower View Drop Down
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  Quote Outlawgrower Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 March 2010 at 05:15
A response to Sensi Seed, too large to post on forum.

http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/showthread.php?t=2012&page=6

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  Quote Ganja Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 March 2010 at 13:14
Ah, so you're 'JessE'. That would explain why you went to the trouble of reposting such a long-winded thread and also why you get a little testy when your received information and muddled version of events is shown to be incorrect.
Why didn't you use the same name on these forums? Concerned that your promotional prose singing the praises of MNS might seem a little biased?

As I said, it's really not worth anyone's time trying to point out to you that the ersatz 'facts' of which you're so convinced are simply second hand advertising material that you've built into a story. Have fun with it, believe what you like. It's nice to feel like you have inside information.

The salient facts - of which everyone who knows this business is aware - are that Sensi Seed Bank represents the entire gene-stock of The Seed Bank and lots more besides. This is undisputed, unlike the various stories of who stole what from whom and who has the real originals, as in the neverending story revolving around GHS and MNS.

It's also worth pointing out that Nevil ran the Seed Bank for around 5 years, whereas the same strains and more have been offered by Sensi Seed Bank for around 20 years. Any information or reports about 'the good old days' are far more likely to refer to the period that it's been the Sensi Seed Bank. Were you growing in 1987?

All the 'insider' gossip about 'why don't Sensi do this or that like Nevil did' is simply people parroting received opinions. If you've actually tried those strains from the actual good old days they were almost certainly from the Sensi Seed Bank. Simple fact.

Then again, when I skimmed through your attempt to debunk the facts above, I noticed that you may not actually understand the concept of dates. You confidently asserted that NL#5 was first available in 1988.
I pointed out that it was offered in the 1987 catalogue.
Your response was to post a scan of the May 1 1987 update (to the 86/87 catalogue), describe it as being from 'March 1987', then somehow assert that this meant 'we' didn't know everything.
Odd.
I suggest you look up the 1987 Revised catalogue, which proves the point that NL5 was used in commercially available hybrids in 1987, which means it was being worked with at least a year - maybe two - before that. Hence, your idea that from 1988 is clearly rubbish.

You reproduce a post that's apparently from shantibaba, which says "...germinated some stock seed from 1988 where the original Northern light 5 originated from"

Now, there may be some context in the rest of that thread that I'm unaware of, or it could be someone else using the name 'shantibaba'. I have no idea. What I do have is an actual document from 1987 which demonstrates this this is simply not the case.








So, which to believe, a forum post from 2007 or printed material from 20 years before? Tough decision.

Also, your assertion that NL came from the US in clone form seems to have been pulled out of thin air.

I only just read the pompous preamble to your post on MN forums, and I had no idea that you thought so highly of your own 'research'. I hope you'll understand that the above are just small examples of why I don't. You're cobbling together rumours and not even doing a very good job of that.

Your tone of a wounded truth-seeker is not very convincing, and if you believe that the first post in this thread was not hyperbolic promotional material ... I don't really know what to say.

Also on the subject of research, if you'd taken even a cursory look around these forums, you'd see that I've stated on many occasions that, to the best of my knowledge, the Northern Lights offered by Sensi Seeds is NL 5x2. This comes from asking the people who have first hand knowledge. I'm not sure what more confirmation you want.

Again, this demonstrates that your assertions ("the main question posed in the thread at the Sensi Seed forums was never addressed (lol), which was whether or not the Northern Lights variety currently offered by Sensi Seeds is in fact the same as it was during the late 1980's") are supported by a laughable lack of research.
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  Quote Bowen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 March 2010 at 14:59
So is it a mystery then lol, i remember reading that the northern lights (fem) variety thats offered has been back crossed with an afghani ancestor anyways, which would change it yet again?? would it not?
 
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  Quote Ganja Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 March 2010 at 15:27
Not a mystery, really. It's NL 5x2.

I'm pretty sure that for while in the 90s NL#1 was the standard Northern Lights sold in seed form. NL 5x2 was more resinous, if less typically squat Afghani, and was preferred by many.

By all accounts, Sensi Northern Lights remains NL 5x2.
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  Quote Bowen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 March 2010 at 16:02
Sweet, thats the type that got crossed with the haze then? Some called it NL#5x Haze others called it brainstorm IIRC.
 
I love how these guys come out of the woodwork periodically to try and tell you where your plants ancestry hails from lol.
 
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EDIT: Just read jesses post there on that other forum and i've come to the lengthly conclusion that he is basically making his opinions from mis-information. I love how he claims to have the inside track on sensi knowledge. NOT Possible!!
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  Quote Ganja Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 March 2010 at 16:51
Good to see you around again, Bowen.

NL#5 is a building block in many top notch strains - NL#5xHaze, Shiva Skunk, Silver Pearl (RIP) and, to the best of my knowledge, the Northern Lights seed strain and Jack Herer (which would also make it an ancestor of Jack Flash and Mother's Finest).

JessE is still at it. I seem to have touched a nerve. He's made a yet another long post which  cherry-picks quotes and still fails to make a coherent argument.

This is why I avoid breeding discussions with cannabis anoraks. If I share what I know, someone who thinks they have the inside story is almost certain to hit CAPSLOCK and start raving about what they 'know' from reading other forums and fourth-hand information.
I'm not a primary source of info, as I didn't do any of the breeding, but I've been here a long time and I've actually met almost everyone mentioned in JessE's thread.

Things would actually be a lot easier if I didn't try to be as accurate as possible. It would be easier to say 'Yes! Of course! 43% THC!' to every question, as is the case on an alarming number of seed-sellers' forums. As it happens, the various claims of original genetics and decades of breeding made by every overnight seed company are actually true in the case of Sensi. It's one of the few things in the jungle of canna-breeding lore that's NOT in dispute. Still, the peanut gallery pipes up, based on a forum post they once saw, so it's usually best to ignore them.

Lemarcel, on the 'family tree' thread is an example of someone researching the subject in an intelligent way...

At first I thought 'outlaw grower' was just a bit mouthy and sure of his received info. Then it was clear he was JessE and saw himself as a herald of MNS seeds (whether employed or kissing ass in the hope of recognition). He lives in a strange little corner of the cannabis community if he thinks cannabis seed companies 'threaten' one another...

Since the last post, however, it's clear he's something of a coward and a liar. In his cherry-picking, he wasn't brave enough to reproduce the part where his 'primary source' (a forum post, big surprise) stating that NL#5 is from 1988 is flatly disproven by printed material from 1987. Sad, really.

Moving on to a less tiresome subject, Dam is doing pretty well, but the new conservative attitude hasn't gone away yet. There's a good chance things will remain much the same for years to come, but the government just dissolved and no-one knows what the next administration will bring...
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  Quote Bowen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 March 2010 at 18:29
43%thc lol. Id like me some of that mythic plant please!!! You're right about the family trees, I found that to bear some weight when im thinking about future strains for my collection/cupboard lol. Could do with a new layout though, one thats easier on the eyes a bit.
 
1987 catalogues is NL#5 first appeance then and hes claiming it was invented in '88? Highly doubtfull lmao, this guy is obviously someone with a bit of knowledge on the subject but just dosent commit to putting the effort in and seperating fact from FICTION (sorry bout the caps lol, damn button should never have been invented).
 
MNS = Mr nice seedbank? correct? Is he really an ambassador for them? I really hope not lol.
 
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Dissolved, really!! I tell you if they feck that country up it will be a criyng shame. Its the only place really thats left where you can go into a shop, relax, have a nice spliff, coffee and have all that cultural diversity to boot.
 
Im growing ever so tired of my own city, paramilitary groups on the rise again, policemen being blown up and shot at. Bombs being left in city centres. Businessmen being shot for selling legal highs and much much more. If i diddnt know better id think i was in a warzone.  Also a man was executed not too long ago, shot in the back of the head twice whilst bound and gagged. This isn't the 60's 70's 80's or 90's, but it sure feels like them.
 
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  Quote sarah louise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 March 2010 at 20:51
Introducing the Outlawgrower/JessE Method.... How to make yourself look like a twat in 3 easy lessons. I'm glad he has decided to retire to MNS to lick his wounds in a more friendly circumstances.
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  Quote Ganja Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2010 at 15:17
I know, I shouldn't bother with such people. Their intent/attitude is usually clear right away. Deleting or ignoring is a better policy, but I never know - some people might actually be seeking information....

Still, the banhammer would mean I don't have to read their carping. Oh well.

Bowen - I've heard from more than one Irish friend that the paramilitaries haven't gone away and are even making themselves known again. Here's hoping they find something better to do. But if the 'Celtic Tiger' economy is well and truly over, that means a lot more discontent, which is the sort of thing that leads young idiots to crime or radicalism. It's a lot harder to recruit when everyone's pretty well off.

The dissolved Dutch government is a procedural thing rather than a complete collapse. They couldn't agree on something (I think it was pulling NL troops out of Afghanistan) and when no deal is agreed upon after two tries, the government has to dissolve and new elections are required.
Things could turn worse (more CDA and Geert Wilders), but it's also possible that the damn christian democrats will get a kicking from the voters and recede into history. It's the CDA that has prompted most of the tampering with Dam and de-liberalisation that's happened over the last 5-10 years.
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