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jack herer

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alecky View Drop Down
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  Quote alecky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: jack herer
    Posted: 19 August 2010 at 00:55
Just like to ask whats sensiseeds view on nevils claims over at mns forums about jack herer, he claims that Silver Haze(R),jackherer and diesel are all the same cutting and he gives the genetics.
Is any of this true?
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Ganja View Drop Down
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  Quote Ganja Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 August 2010 at 09:54
That's just ridiculous.  Shanti seems okay, but MNS forums is full of wild claims and some of the contributors there are constantly trying to rewrite cannabis history.

As far as I know, Nevil hasn't said anything to the cannabis world for a long, long time. I don't think he's been involved in breeding cannabis since the Nineties (but his name is certainly capitalised upon by certain people). He doesn't post to MNS forums, AFAIK, so the above is from someone who is pretending to quote Nevil.
[There is a poster who uses 'Nevil' as a title, but he seems to sometimes misspell his own name as 'Neville' which sorta kinda suggests that it might not be the guy himself...]

As for the claim itself, it doesn't stand up to basic scrutiny.
  • Nevil wasn't involved in breeding Jack Herer, for a start.
  • For another, Jack Herer is a seed line made from parent-plants (as is Silver Haze) not a cutting! The very wording of the claim 'all from the same cutting' suggests it's from someone who doesn't know the first thing about breeding. Diesel started life as a clone-only strain, I think.
  • Diesel reached Europe many, many years after JH was created, maybe a full decade later. I suppose it might be distantly possible that the original Diesel was a stand-out JH phenotype, but I've never heard this claim being made and I wouldn't believe it myself.
  • Silver Haze has some similar genetic background to JH, but the plants produced by SH look nothing like Jack, so this is just nonsense. Might as well say Hindu Kush is the same 'cutting' as Jamaican Pearl.
I almost can't be bothered going to correct the MNS forums about this. Certain members tend to mess their diapers when they are shown to be wrong.

Still, if you'd be so good as to provide a link to the above claim, I'll take a look and see if it's worth cleaning up.

EDIT - Found it. So, there's a new poster on the MNS forums calling himself Nevil? Oh well. I sincerely doubt it's him. It would be interesting to see the IP numbers of that site. I suspect Nevil's IP would be the same as some other regular on that forum.

Anyway, the proof of the pudding is in the eating. Anyone who's seen a sample of Jack Herer vs Diesel vs Silver Haze can easily and unambiguously tell that they are entirely different plants. Different structure, different aroma and different effect. Obviously not the same strain and utterly incapable of being same clone. Child's play.

Whoever is posting the info as 'Nevil' on MNS is full of shit.
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alecky View Drop Down
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  Quote alecky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 August 2010 at 15:40
Nice one Ganja,thanks for answering and shedding some light on this.The reason i asked is cause shanti introduced the poster as nevil.Id be afraid to ask is it even nevil posting at mns incase they put a hit out on me!There are some very sensitive forum members over there!

So i decided to ask here and get the definitive answer from the horses mouth.

All i can say is im a novice and ive one JH in flower at the moment and ive never seen anything like it, its only four weeks in 12/12 and absolutely covered in buds.
And unlike what i was led to belive its fairly easy to grow. I have a spiermite prob at the moment and i also had it in too small a pot for a while and as a result it could look better. Heres a few pics.





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Proteus View Drop Down
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  Quote Proteus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 August 2010 at 15:45

Thats a fantastic looking plant. Hope you got a cutting.

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alecky View Drop Down
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  Quote alecky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 August 2010 at 16:00
I did proteus i have four clones rooted!I germinated 5seeds, one didnt make it,2 males 2 females.I gave the other female to my brother.Ive 5seeds in the fridge for a rainy day.
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coxnox View Drop Down
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  Quote coxnox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 August 2010 at 23:55
Originally posted by Ganja

Anyway, the proof of the pudding is in the eating. Anyone who's seen a sample of Jack Herer vs Diesel vs Silver Haze can easily and unambiguously tell that they are entirely different plants.
nevil is talking about Super-Silver-Haze, not Sensi Silver Haze...with the lot of information given by this member on the old genetics from the seed bank company it can be another body than nevil himself...
 
[snip]

Originally posted by Nevil

Your quite right Bigherb, It was Super_Silver_Haze.
Super_Siver_Haze, Jack Herrer and Diesel are not different lineages, they are the same cutting!
Sam would have had the same problem as me. The seeds were very old, either nothing of consequence came up or he didn't keep cuttings of what came up.
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  Quote Ganja Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 August 2010 at 10:41
"Super Siver Haze, Jack Herrer[sic] and Diesel are not different lineages, they are the same cutting!"

No they are not. Simple as that.

No-one has ever claimed this before, because it's not true.

Anyone who claims the above is full of shit, no matter who they are or who they say they are.

NB - you'd think that anyone so 'deep' in the cannabis industry would know how to spell Jack Herer's name. He's been a pretty important figure for over 20 years...
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playedout View Drop Down
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  Quote playedout Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 August 2010 at 12:46
I'd sooner listen to neville than you ganja, no offence.
at least shanti and neville are still relevent unlike sensi who chose to rest on their laurel. The lack of traffic on this forum is proof nobody cares about sensi seed anymore! strains gone to crap since the 90's when I grew 12 strains from sensi.
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  Quote alecky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 August 2010 at 14:24
Well i belive ganja and sensiseeds,they have been around a long time,longer than any other seed bank.Also this guy introduced as "nevil" could be anyone.I find it strange that members on MNS readily belive it is nevil without any proof,only shanti's introduction.
I reckon its jesse on another power trip,backing up all the crazy claims he makes.

I agree there not much forum traffic here but maybe thats cause we more intrested in getting on with the growing and leaving the bullshit history where it belongs,in the past.
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Ganja View Drop Down
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  Quote Ganja Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 August 2010 at 23:12
It's not a matter of believing me. It's common knowledge. These aren't 'my' facts, they're out there for anyone to look up. Anyone can write anything in a forum post, but claiming that JH and Diesel are the same plant simply flies in the face of the established facts. It's just stupid. But believe what you like.

SSH is generally accepted as being an attempt to recreate Jack Herer from similar parent plants several years later. Again, you can look this up.

Fun experiment: find one other claim that Jack Herer and Diesel are the same plant. I sincerely doubt you will. They look, smell and feel entirely different. They're separated by about five to eight years and are from different continents.

But if an anonymous forum post all it takes to make you believe an entirely new piece of fake info, one that contraditcs reality and all other established info ... fine. Have fun with it. You're sure to learn lots more useful information this way.
"Who're you gonna believe, MNS or your own lyin' eyes, baby?"

As for claims of relevance and people caring ... form your own opinion. Sensi doesn't really like to brag about its size, but you could add GHS to MNS plus a third seed co of your choice and you still wouldn't quite be there. After 25 years of being the single largest breeder, it might be hard to imagine just how widespread Sensi strains are, but it's orders of magnitude greater than the more recent companies.

I'm not sure you understand how big the global cannabis community is. either. I won't try to explain, but the earnest, alarmist discussions at MNS about the potential 'genetic bottleneck' caused by feminised seeds makes me chuckle. Again, the world of cannabis is orders of magnitude larger than they seem to understand.

MNS customers seem satisfied, for the most part, but are there actually any seeds for sale at the moment? When I go to the forums, half the discussion seems to be people begging Shanti to return and restock strain x or y.
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